Inline fuel filter with diesel?

[JimC]

Heres a pic from an ECR project - they've used the V8 fuel lines and have an inline fuel filter in the stock position. I wonder what the effect of that is? Won't it have to be changed kinda often? I have to change the larger diesel one every few thousand miles.

Does Mike have an explanation?

[MonLand]

Hi Jim, I think you forgot to attach the pic?

[JimC]

Not possible!

[Shane@EVS]

I can't say what ECR is doing but you can get a strainer to put in place of the factory gas filter, though the ones I have seen are just barbed and not the same fittings as the V8 version.

[ECR]

Its not a filter.
Its a SS canister that looks like a filter so that we can use the same production CNC made SS fuel lines on both the gas and the diesel.

[JimC]

At least you dont have to replace it.

[evilfij]

All well and good until someone takes it to a shop other than ECR and asks to have the fuel filter changed . . . .

[ECR]

Guess that would be a pretty stupid mechanic considering it says "Not a filter, do not change" on it and the customer is made aware of what it is as well.

If you don't like it you are welcome to pay all the set up costs in order to make a new supply line just for the few NAS diesels out there. Oh yeah... then folks would complain that the stainless lines for the diesel costs to much.

Most Tdi conversions I have seen done by other places have a piece of rubber hose fitted in there and that will decay. At least this solution is a long term one, being all stainless.

[JimC]

Works for me, since it looks like a good place to splice in for a second fuel tank.

Mike - What do you do for stainless 110 brake lines?

[ECR]

Same as the other lines. Classic Tube makes them for us, stainless lines with stainless fittings. Most other places offer stainless lines with standard steel fittings.

[pendy]

Do Not Change!

[cbass]

That's a good use of the stock fuel line with the diesel conversion. You could easily turn it into a pre-filter like what is fitted on many Mercedes diesels from the factory. See my post here about the pre-filter that I installed on my TDI Jetta: http://twowheelphotos.blogspot.com/2007/08/hebmller-pre-filter.html

If there is a pre-filter, the purpose of it is simply to catch any large particles >150 microns before they get to the main filter, thus prolonging the life of the main filter. Mine has caught a few visible particles already, and in addition, it lets you see the state of your diesel fuel on those cold days!

[pendy]

This is how I do it. Hydraulic hose to the steel line and a Racor

JP

[cbass]

So that's your main filter then isn't it pendy? I know Jetta TDI's have a fuel return line going back to the main filter to dump the excess fuel. Does this engine not require that? Or does it return somewhere closer to the injection pump?

Very clean install BTW:toast

[pendy]

Yeah main. Returns to tank by design. Thanks

[ECR]

This is how I do it. Hydraulic hose to the steel line and a Racor

JP


Thanks cool, but it wouldn't last one New England winter in that location.
The factory Tdis had a filter in that location and on the "grey market" imports we work on and you wouldn't believe how often we have to change the stuff back there from dirt, snow, ice and salt eating it.
We use the factory filter in the factory fender mount location. Racors do filter better, used to use them on boats.

[Overlander]

And the Racor's have the option of adding/replacing the see through bowl with a bowl that has an integrated heating element for extreme cold weather!

Pendy installed mine and no issues so far, plus it's easy to get to. I understand Mikes concern as well, however not an issue in North Carolina. No rust from the hydraulic lines that Pendy installed. Also, Pendy installed with it the factory TDI fuel filter in the factory location under the wing, which now operates as a secondary, since my Racor replaceable filter is 60 micron. I can handle crap fuel in this setup.

I'll have to consider what can be done to the Racor mount to prevent rust, although it is made of aluminum, the filter canister gets change every season as part of regular maintenance, and the bowl is lexan, so it won't rust.

[JimC]

So the stock lift pump has no problem pulling fuel through the extra Racor - or do you have to upgrade or something. I thought the lift pumps were sensitive to extra loads.

[Overlander]

I'm not perceiving any with the stock 2.8 lift pump.

[cbass]

How does the 2.8 work, is there a lift pump in the tank as well as the injection pump pulling fuel? Because if that's the case, then I wouldn't think there would be a problem with a slightly restricted flow in most applications. One option for a filter might be a Stanadyne option too, they make some big ones that are very high flow

[JimC]

300tdi and, I presume, 2.8 TGV have mechanical cam-driven lift pumps on the right side of the block below the air filter.

[pendy]

I think the stock sedimentor is further forward Mike. I got guys in Canada running it in that location where I installed it. No issues yet. Seems to be an area that stays fairly clean on the truck.
Its always a prefilter/sedimentor and water trap. I always use the stock filter as well. On a 2.8l you need it for the priming button. You can bleed an installed dry filter with that priming pump.
JP

[ECR]

I think the stock sedimentor is further forward
JP


Factory unit location.

Cool the Racor works for you. :) :)

[evilfij]

Ugh, factory location looks like it would pick up a lot of crap. I should have known ECR would have posted a warning on it . . . .

[pendy]

Thanks for the picture. Those sedimentor gaurds are a pain to work with. :toast

Factory unit location.

Cool the Racor works for you. :) :)

[evilfij]

Reminds me of the "box" that the fuel pump on Janey lives in.

[cgalpin]

Janey's is a little further forward on the frame rail, and looks similar (but not as pretty). Still works fine though :)

I do need to buy a spare pump in case that dies - it's the only bit of electrics she depends on outside of the distributor.

charles

[pendy]

I've got a used one for you Charles. Let me know.

[cgalpin]

Yeah that'll work, thanks! Send me an email pls.

charles

[evilfij]

"Still works fine though "

Glad to hear Mike's fix in Iowa is still holding. The wires got pretty nasty and lost contact so he did something.

[cgalpin]

I was referring to the cover, but the pump works too :) I did have to remove the pump, and clean the connections and the points where the bolts met the frame to get a good ground though. I removed the bottom portion of the pump to clean it out (expected an air filter but it was full of fuel too) - got a bunch of crap out of it. Sadly I didn't take any pictures.

I had to run a dedicated ground to it to get home though - remember it stopped working before I got out of town :).

BTW, I'm close to having put 2K miles on her now. I need to scrounge up my gas receipts and see what the fuel mileage has been.

charles

[junkyddog11]

Another take on it. We use a 300tdi tank and the genuine viton full hose set. No pipes at all. If we aren't using the factory hoses we use all USCG approved flex line, stem to stern. If its good enough for the bilge, then it should be fine on the Rover.The "filter" in the wheel well is a really just a sediment cyclone and never needs to be replaced and as it is all stainless, aluminum and plastic and if you don't use the silly factory sheetmetal "guard" there is nothong to rust (we galvanize it). Then we run a Racor or standard filter depending on owner preference.

[ECR]

Looks nice.

My customers want the diesel, but want to save as much money as possible, so we use as many of the existing perfectly good NAS parts as possible to keep the costs down beacuse with a perfectly good NAS tank, slight modification of the existing pump and all there is no need for the additional cost. IMO.

[Chaucer]

Another take on it. We use a 300tdi tank and the genuine viton full hose set.

By genuine, you mean the factory genuine LR hoses are viton?

[junkyddog11]

Looks nice.

My customers want the diesel, but want to save as much money as possible, so we use as many of the existing perfectly good NAS parts as possible to keep the costs down beacuse with a perfectly good NAS tank, slight modification of the existing pump and all there is no need for the additional cost. IMO.
Thanks. We also normally use as much of the original truck as possible. Just offering another take on it all.

This job used a Genuine parts Rover Tdi frame and the NAS tank does not fit....or even close. Customer wanted to build with as many Genuine Tdi parts as possible. In reality the tank and all fuel associated parts would only add up to about 1 of the total job cost...but this is not I suppose the average job and I wouldn't be arguing with the customer about spending his money to make what is essentially "factory correct".

It is shocking the amount of time and $$ it takes to turn a perfectly good NAS spec Defender into something that in the rest of the world would be considered glorified farm equipment :)

Follow-up Post:

By genuine, you mean the factory genuine LR hoses are viton?It is my understanding that the factory hoses from the rear tank 300 Tdi are viton lined. Why I think this I do not know...or should say cannot remember. I do know that 100% biodiesel and / or SVO has no ill effect on them, which does not mean they are Viton.

I will, when back at the shop, dig a little deeper and get the actual spec on these.

[Manimal]

Factory unit location.

Cool the Racor works for you. :) :)

I have one of those (in that picture) on my NAS 300tdi.

Forgive my ignorance, I know you explained it earlier in the thread but, what exactly is in that box?

[Dennis]

My 300tdi has 100K+ on it now. I left the gas filter in place. When it started getting "plugged-up", the engine would lose power under acceleration. That filter lasted at least 80K miles before it became an issue. When I changed it out, the lack of acceleration problem went away. No other issues noted by leaving the gas line filter in place.

Dennis