Do your mother a favor

[rover4x4]

Leave the D-90's at home and drive the econo box to work :finger . happy earth day people.

[Mike Hippert]

Phillip my econo box is a bike, and my 20 min drive would take over an hour at my rate. How about this, I will work on my earth relocation and earth agitating skills today.

[Doug]

I'm sure with higher gas prices the amount of auto pollution is way down. Tax gas another buck or two a gallon and the problem is gone. We'll all be riding Mike's bike, breathing fresh air and saving our gas for weekend romps.

DW

[mhansen]

Brothers of the D-90 source;

The reasons we all drive Rovers is as individual as the aftermarket parts we adorn them with. But one major reason we drive them is that they are eco friendly----- friendly to our economy.

We all buy gas at $2.00+ a gallon to feed our 14 MPG thirsty beasts. And with the price of parts and the frequency of breakdowns how would our favorite vendors or Land Rover Centres survive, IF WE DON"T DRIVE!!!

Screw earth day! Give our country's economy a boost! DRIVE YOUR ROVERS!!!! TODAY AND EVERY DAY!!!!!!

:thumbs

[Ragland]

Originally posted by mhansen


...14 MPG...




Move over Honda Insight!

Anyone with a Defender getting 14 mpg wins my vote an Earth Day award. :grin

[TwisteD90]

14 MPG??? is that in the D90 or Disco? I have no idea what's my 90's MPG but I know my Disco gets 10MPG in the highway :mad

[dmarchand]

My ride into work today, and almost everyday is my Bianchi SASS. Single speed all the way baby...

My favorite decal on the frame is: "Cars are Coffins".

[rover4x4]

I hope I will be able to ride my bike to work...

[mhansen]

Originally posted by TwisteD90
14 MPG??? is that in the D90 or Disco? I have no idea what's my 90's MPG but I know my Disco gets 10MPG in the highway :mad

Yousef-:stick
You are supposed to air down when you GET to Moab, not when you leave for Moab.:grin

[dmarchand]

Riding into work is not for the faint of heart. I had four "accidents" last year, and two this year already. Including hitting a runner at full speed (she turned without looking), and side swiping a cab mirror since he wouldn't give me right of way.

Last year, my highlight was rear ending a car at full speed on Beacon Hill. I ended up on top of the trunk.

[Eric Siepmann]

Sounds like my daily commute to the loop in Chicago last year! Ahh memories. Never had the balls to run my Sycip Diesel Singlespeed. Just rode my cross bike.

EwS

[Mike Hippert]

Mike, LOL.

Dave, "Cars are Coffins" I don't think I would mind dieing in my 90, when people ask about buying it I always tell them they will have to pry it from my cold dead hands!

On the bike accidents with bikes I once hit a chipmunk as it darted out in front of me. What type of car did you rear end?

[flippedrover]

Originally posted by dmarchand
Riding into work is not for the faint of heart. I had four "accidents" last year, and two this year already. Including hitting a runner at full speed (she turned without looking), and side swiping a cab mirror since he wouldn't give me right of way.

Last year, my highlight was rear ending a car at full speed on Beacon Hill. I ended up on top of the trunk.

Remind me to stay f....................................ar a..................way from you when you are driving.:finger

[dmarchand]

Mike, I know that feeling. I've run over a squirrel on my road bike while cruising around North Conway. Just sat in the middle of the road and watched me come at him. Surprisingly, he came out okay.

I rear ended a Camry, older model (early 90's). I as surprised the trunk only had a minor dent in it and I wasn't able to break the rear windshield. Nothing like hearing "oh my god!" from the sidewalk as I hit the car. It was like slow motion. Brakes fully locked, skidding out of control. The driver slammed on his brakes because someone pulled out of a spot in front of him. He was really cool about it, said his son was a bike commuter as well.

Surprisingly, my driving is relatively tame. It's my biking that gets me in trouble... :cool:

[Art Vigil]

Jetta TDI = nearly 50MPG (and diesel prices):grin

[Ragland]

I know I'm about to incur some wrath on this one but...

Bikes and cars don't mix well. Accidents will occur, but cyclists will be disproportionately impacted. Bikes aren't as visible, can't really maintain a lane well, and often force cars to maneuver around suddenly. I'm all for people choosing a transportation method undoubtedly healthier and cleaner. But let's have designated bike lanes.

Why do I say this here? Because if someone pulls out in a car, my D-90 will make some crumpled sheet-metal. If a cyclist does the same, my truck will hurt them severely, even more so than if hitting a typical car.

Off my box now, so flame on

[rover4x4]

I hit a dog once on my bike. going the better part of 24mph at night while returning home from refreshments...

[rover4x4]

see when you hit someone in your truck, they will be driving your truck and living in your house. watch out for people on bikes.

[TwisteD90]

Hahaha you are funny mike ;)

I thought about getting one of those single speed moped but riding on a single speed for 30 miles each way is not going to happen :(

[Eric Siepmann]

Originally posted by Ragland
I know I'm about to incur some wrath on this one but...

Bikes and cars don't mix well. Accidents will occur, but cyclists will be disproportionately impacted. Bikes aren't as visible, can't really maintain a lane well, and often force cars to maneuver around suddenly. I'm all for people choosing a transportation method undoubtedly healthier and cleaner. But let's have designated bike lanes.



That's just ignorant! You can't just lay blame on either the cyclist or driver. Each case is different. As far a visibility, that just says your an inattentive driver. I can spot a cyclist easily and without the need to manouver around them. Granted sometimes cyclists dart in front of you. So do cars, cabs and trucks. It happens and the person is to blame not the method of transport. As far a maintaining a lane well, I can ride in a rain gutter 16 inches wide for hours on end. I can't tell you how many times I have been riding the road in Euro trash jersey and shorts (loud and colorful), minding my own business well off the on the shoulder and some prick on a cell phone, some mom yelling at her kids, or someone ass who just feels bikes don't belong has had to swerve to avoid hitting me on the shoulder.

As far as building bike lanes, why? Do you wan't your taxes to go up? I don't! And where the hell are you going to put a bike lane in metro Chicago? Segreagtion isn't a solution. I think people just need to get their heads out of their asses and pay attention to the road when driving. Put the cell away, focus on actually driving.

Try cycling to work for a week... In the least you'll save a tank of gas and understand what it's like to ride among road raging assholes, soccer moms and good drivers.

EwS

[mhansen]

Damn cyclists---thats why I have an ARB bull bar.

[Ragland]

Eric,

Didn't mean to piss anyone off. Visibility is a concern, especially at night or twilight. A bike does not have the same visual profile as a car, nor has as many lights. Cyclists are generally moving slower than normal traffic patterns. Many bikers demand quite a bit of road space, to the extent a D-90 will not fit safely within the same lane. Don't label me or anyone else a bad driver, or a cellphone talker and soccer mom. If biking in traffic proved to be such an ease, bikers like yourself wouldn't be so hateful toward drivers.

The ability of a bike to negotiate a roadway is severely diminished with respects to a car. The bike will rarely maintain a flow pattern with existing traffic - creating a situation where accidents are more likely to occur. In such accidents, bikers are, again, at a severe disadvantage.

Regardless who is at fault, bikers will not fare well in traffic accidents. Just like small, slow planes are banned from large busy airports. As for the bike lanes, many places put a stripe down the existing sidewalk or on the roadside.

Besides, calm down. No one is taking up legislation against bikes like some want for SUV's - D-90's included.

[Mike Hippert]

some prick on a cell phone, some mom yelling at her kids, or someone ass who just feels bikes don't belong has had to swerve to avoid hitting me on the shoulder.

These people make my drive more interesting, lets just say I have convinced a few cell phone drivers to put the F'n phone down and pay attention.:pissed

[dmarchand]

Robert, unfortunately I see no point in your mentally impaired rant. You are bringing up an issue, that wasn't a part of this thread.

Bikes and cars don't mix well. Accidents will occur, but cyclists will be disproportionately impacted.

No shit. You are a master at stating the obvious.

Try cycling to work for a week... In the least you'll save a tank of gas and understand what it's like to ride among road raging assholes, soccer moms and good drivers.

This was well put. Robert, fact is I know we are out numbered as cyclists and commuters. I accept the fact I can get hit by another driver at any time.

Your rant was born of the wrong idea. We were discussing commuting, as it relates to Earth Day, and shared a few stories of bike commuting. You seem to have mistaken that for an opportunity to discuss a larger issue. One which you don't have any understanding of.

Why do I say this here? Because if someone pulls out in a car, my D-90 will make some crumpled sheet-metal. If a cyclist does the same, my truck will hurt them severely, even more so than if hitting a typical car.

That is the most ridiculous thing I have ever heard (okay, maybe not). Of course your going to hit a cyclist. Just as you would a pedestrian, or a car, or a fucking tree that jumps out at you. Are you tough because your driving that "D-90"? Sounds like that's your attitude as a driver. That's a shame. Pull your head out of your ass and realize your one of a billion people on the planet. You are neither that signifcant or important to act so tough. Perhaps you would pay better attention to your surroundings if you shrugged off some of that attitude.

So where are you going with this little "soapbox" issue of yours? Does it have any relative point to this thread?

[dmarchand]

Many bikers demand quite a bit of road space, to the extent a D-90 will not fit safely within the same lane. Don't label me or anyone else a bad driver, or a cellphone talker and soccer mom. If biking in traffic proved to be such an ease, bikers like yourself wouldn't be so hateful toward drivers.

Umm. How about slowing down and waiting to pass a biker if you feel it is unsafe. Oh, sorry. Your in such a hurry...

Unfortunately, your like most people on the road Robert. In too much of a hurry with zero patience or tolerance.

The ability of a bike to negotiate a roadway is severely diminished with respects to a car. The bike will rarely maintain a flow pattern with existing traffic - creating a situation where accidents are more likely to occur. In such accidents, bikers are, again, at a severe disadvantage.


Oh my god. I'm so glad Captain Obvious showed up again. I did not realize I couldn't stop a 5K lbs. truck with my body. I'll have to ride smarter in the future.

[Mike Hippert]

So in not wanting to be so negative about Earthday, I have decided to pick up trash along my next jaunt into the woods. My problem is what can you do to stop people from dumping cars and tires all over the place?

I talked to a Police Officer (I was kinda trespassing, not really it was a road on privet property that was not clearly marked) and when I left the area he pulled me over, he was glad he caught me, he did not give me a ticket because allot of people go out there, but he did give me his # and asked me to let him know if anything strange was going on out there. He can't patrol the area in his car but he asked if I could keep an eye out for him.

So I am pretty sure this happens all over the place as there was allot of trash on the trails in PA, but what can you do besides clean it up?

[Ragland]

Dave,

I only made the comments in response to prior postings. It's not a rant, just an observation.

What's with the block on the shoulder kind of insults. No, I'm not stupid, a bad driver, or feel tough driving a defender. If I'm stating the obvious, why lash out.

If bikes were given the same consideration as anything else sharing the road, Ralph Nader and the other safety Nazis would have tried to ban them for lack of safety.

Don't be an asshole simply because you think someone might have a different opinion.

[Eric Siepmann]

Robert,

I never called you anything but ignorant. Your second post does nothing to dissuade me from my first observation.

If you have ever been hit, run-off the road, raged at, or just viewed as a common criminal for persuing your passions you'd be pretty pissed with your own statementsas well. If you ever had a friend die from being hit by a car who was at fault.....

Your lack of insight and knowledge about something as simple and enjoyable as a bike is appalling. Bikes flow with traffic and in most cases can out manouver them.

Airports allow small planes to land. I travel extensively and have seen pipers land next to 747 at Chicago O'hare Int'l. Which obviously isn't a big airport at all. Happens all the time.

People seek to legislate cyclists out of every place. Educate yourself. There many bills, not laws, in place to limit cyclsts of all kinds. And yes the proper term is a bill until passed into law.

And here's my last two cents. Don't post your anti-cycling drivel in the middle of a post about earth day and people who are sharing their experiences riding their bikes to work. Especially if you can't logically defend your position in a debate and then cry like a school girl when a cyclists pimp slaps your ass back to the fifties where it belongs.

EwS

[Ragland]

Originally posted by Eric Siepmann


...Educate yourself. There many bills...
EwS

[rover4x4]

haha its not even earth day but it is 4/20..... :wow

[Eric Siepmann]

Of which we aren't talking about here. And I do follow what my elected officials are sponsoring....Locally, Statewide and Nationally.

[Ragland]

Guys calm down, please. I like riding bikes, too. It's just my opinion they don't work well in modern traffic. Not on all roads, just where there is heavy traffic. A go-kart or atv makes about as much sense.

So go practice your "pimp slaps" in front of the mirror, Eric. Better yet, plan a summer vacation in China, where a real biker's paradise awaits.

[dmarchand]

Don't be an asshole simply because you think someone might have a different opinion

Rob, your "opinion" (or observation which you use interchangeably in error) came from no where. It subsequently went no where. You decided to voice an opinion, of which you know nothing about. You can have an opinion all you want. But at the very least, back it up.

Sadly you can't. Your statements aren't even relevant to the thread, the topic or anything anyone else posted. So I'm calling you out. You put your "flame" suit on sparky.

If bikes were given the same consideration as anything else sharing the road, Ralph Nader and the other safety Nazis would have tried to ban them for lack of safety.

WTF is that supposed to mean? What on earth are you trying to support by saying that? I don't even like Nader, but you have nothing of relevance in this response. Of course bikes aren't given the same consideration. They are a minority. Nobody is debating that.

Rob, when was the last time you rode a bike? Have you ever ridden one in a city? On the street....

[loykd]

Pardon me, but I thought D-90 Source was supposed to be "different" from the other BBS'.... :confused

[Ragland]

Dave,

My flame suit hasn't even begun to warm up.

You and Eric on the other hand are on fire, spewing like an aneurysm.

Why is it I get the feeling the two of you have been sprayed by passing cars one too many times?

Do you yell at walkers who stray into the bike lane?

[dmarchand]

Wow, finally a response that makes sense. And it's direct too.

Way to go Robert. :clap Your all grown up now.

No Robert. I don't recall ever being sprayed by a car. I typically hog the road. :finger

[Eric Siepmann]

I get sprayed all the time, part of the fun.

I'll leave you with this Robert. Ever been to Europe? Everyday proof positive that bikes work in modern traffic. In Amsterdam there are more bikes per capita than cars. How about Paris and Rome? Bikes work in modern traffic, even more congested than most US cities.

My whole point was that your original post was ignorant and lacked any factual basis. Your replies as well.

Walk in someone elses shoes before you form your opinions. Take my challenge and ride to work for one week.

And as far as hating drivers, I don't. I live and let live. But Ignorant stupid posts like yours really piss me off. Have you read your own posts? Hitler? Airports? Turning Ratios? You come off sounding the complete fool. When all we are saying is stop spewing nonsensical crap you can't back up and just realize that bikes belong and are not the root of every accident on the road. Just like I said the first time.

I just get the distinct impression you live in this small world and are unwilling and unable to accept reality. Probably the furthest thing from the truth as well. It's like me sayin the state of LA. is useless if it weren't for new Orleans and Mardi Gras. I've been there, experienced beautiful back country roads with gorgeous scenery, met nice people and ate fine food. All in LA, And how did I do this? Experience and know this?


On my Road bike touring.....on vacation.

EwS

[Ragland]

Okay debater boys, here's one I encountered.

Driving on a 45 mph listed four lane road, with the traffic doing 40 - 50. Line of cars ahead in my lane includes a big Ryder. The wind force from the truck blows biker (doing 15 - 20) around to where he almost falls into the driving lane. Two or three cars (including myself) would likely have had no time to react.

Sure, this is an isolated incident. No, it does not form the basis for legal action, legislation (pending or passed, Eric), or damning bikers. Only, my own opinion is that bikes do not belong in heavy traffic. You are free to disagree, free to call me ignorant, free to suggest I'm from the 50's.

Paris is a disaster for traffic. Germany is better with bike lanes (yes, Eric, worse for taxes). Glad you found LA a good place to visit. Be careful riding on River Road, it may seem great for bikes but people get hit there a lot. If you come back, I might even offer some recommendations, though you've been rather snide.

[Mike Hippert]

I think you guys need to settle this OFF the BOARD. It is not relevant to the topic.

[Ragland]

So Eric, where did you ride/eat/visit while in LA?

[Eric Siepmann]

If you're really curious PM. MH is right.

EwS

[chrisvonc]

edit: I just saw Mike stepped in so this comment has been removed

It is not reasonable in todays "Me me me" mentality, ESPECIALLY in a US city environment, to lull yourself into a false sense of security thinking bikes are going to get the respect they deserve on a road here, let alone in a city.

There are a lot of crazy people driving out there and little you on your little bike whacking his mirror with your little bike lock because he is not respecting your space, is not going to do a whole lot for you when that nut bag just flicks his wrist to the right and turns you into a stain on a parked car. You relying on someone else for your safety is a pretty risky chance, one I personally would take more proactive roll in if it was me on a bike.

Bikers ARE the minority.
Bikers ARE hard to see,
but, you CAN control what happens to you better than drivers can, by using a little common sense and evasive action.

Let me add, I grew up riding a bike where ever I wanted to go. I grew up out in the middle of nowhere and so did my friends. If we wanted to see each other outside of school, we put our asses in the seat and rode. I learned long ago, roads were for cars and if I wanted to be on it, you get out of their way. My younger brother still is a riding fool and his road riding reflects that he can not control what people do in their cars or what they could do to him if he is not careful.

I believe in sharing the road but the key word here is SHARING. The groups of riders of 3 or 4 are not so bad but where I live now, but we do have some pretty selfish riders. We have these roaming gangs of riders who have mistaken the Philadelphia suburbs for the Tour De France and act like they have police escorts both in front of them as well as behind and where ever they are riding is exclusively closed to others as they are there. Every weekend these gang go past my house all day long, literally 30 strong, taking up the entire driving lane all bunched together and tearing it up like there is really a yellow shirt hanging on a tree where ever they are trying to get to. Mind you, this is on a road that already has a fairly large buffer lane on each side that cars are not allowed to drive on. They blow through the red lights at one end of my street and they blow through the 2 stop signs, and have even bullied pedestrians already in cross walks at stop intersections.

Like I said, I have no problem giving a bike plenty of room on the road and holding back a little until a safe opportunity to get by them is available, but you need to remember you are sharing the road with much larger, faster moving, and heavier objects and a lot larger percentage of idiot drivers. The odds are already against riders that they are going to get tagged sooner or later if you are not careful and one of Roberts points the way I read it was (which there was absolutely nothing incorrect about), that its going to hurt you the rider more than its going to hurt the driver.

Bottom line... when you are the little mouse on the big game trail, you don't keep running back and forth under the elephants feet without getting smashed at some point, .

[chrisvonc]

Actually, now, after just signing into my email and seeing the number of complaints reported about this thread, it is now closed!